Rally Raid
In The Dust – opening up the Dakar Rally
In The Dust is the racing chat show where the TV studio has to keep pace with the Dakar Rally. Catch up with the Dakar action in the bivouac and on track in the 2024 rally.
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Host Nicola Hume takes time out from the Red Bull Racing podcast Talking Bull and hits the road in a mobile studio to bring you In The Dust. For week one, she’s joined by MTB freerider Matt Jones, who brings his unique insight into the life of an elite athlete.
The spirit of the Dakar is legendary – a bond of friendly rivalry and respect shared between all the competitors who've come together to tackle 8,000km of the toughest racing in the world. In the first episodes of In The Dust, Nicola and Matt explore the nature of sporting relationships in the intensity of the Dakar. They take many forms, team-mates, rivals and even family.
01
Motivation, sacrifice and life-altering decisions
39 min
Motivation, sacrifice and life-altering decisions
Meet exceptional people who've made life-altering decisions to race Dakar, making sacrifices for a dream.
In episode one of In The Dust, we’re joined by Toby Price and Sam Sunderland, who not only share two Dakar wins each, but one of the best friendships in international sport. The pair are team-mates, friends and even share a camper van, clowning around together one minute, training and geeing each other up to push for the front.
Team-mates: Toby Price and Sam Sunderland
© Kin Marcin/Red Bull Content Pool
Price and Sunderland share two Dakar wins each and much more: the pair are team-mates, friends and even share a camper van. They enjoy one of the closest and most unique friendships in sport, clowning around together one minute, training and geeing each other up to push for the front.
They reveal insights into racing at the Dakar, the importance of preparation, but also enjoying your work and key tips for caring for your mullet.
So what is it like racing in the Dakar? “It’s hard to explain to people what we see in the races here and when you’re on the stage,” says Toby. “The only way to describe it is it’s like an adventure. Some of the landscape you see is unbelievable – so we’re pretty lucky to get to see that – but at the same time you’re running on the limit and pushing to get a good stage in.”
“No matter how well you prepare, there’s no way you can race for like 9,000 kilometers without having a drama,” adds Sam. “Sometimes I come back to the camp and the boys asked me how the day went and so much has happened! It's been 10 hours since I last saw them and I might have been dodging animals, had a scary moment on the road, got lost or had a crash. There’s so many things that can happen.”
02
Green battle: Carlos Sainz vs Nasser Al-Attiyah
33 min
Great battles: Carlos Sainz vs Nasser Al-Attiyah
Nasser Al-Attiyah and Carlos Sainz join us to share a unique insight into their friendship and rivalry.
After friends, how about rivals? It doesn’t come much fiercer than the rivalry between Carlos Sainz and Nasser Al-Attiyah. They’re two legends of the Dakar (everyone calls them 'Dakar royalty') and between them they have eight crowns, accrued over 18 years of racing across thousands of kilometers through Europe, Africa, South America and now Asia.
Best of rivals: Nasser Al-Attiyah and Carlos Sainz
© Kin Marcin/Red Bull Content Pool
They look back over nearly two decades of competition that's seen the momentum ebb and flow between them. For Sainz, a two-time WRC champion, while the rivalry is intense, it’s tempered by a profound respect. “The first thing I do after finishing a stage is to check on Nasser’s times,” says El Matador. “When you’ve been fighting for the Dakar for so many years, you know how much effort, how much risk, how much everything you put in and then when you see the other guy is as fast as hell, you have a lot of respect.”
For Nasser – who describes Carlos as his idol – it’s all part of the unique spirit of the Dakar that brings competitors together. “We're crazy and sometimes we fight during the race, but when we finish, we shake hands, we talk about what happened during the race, how many punctures, where you got lost, and you can’t find that in any other sport.”
Nicola and Matt share some clips of the "crazy” such as their racing neck-and-neck in 2011 as team-mates with VW. “This is only 300 meters, we were racing like this for two weeks,” laughs Sainz. “We were lucky that VW allowed us to race to the finish.”
Nasser also takes Nicola for a closer look at his Prodrive Hunter to see how much Nasser relies on his co-driver Matthieu Baumel to guide him through the route. It’s a bold move by the former Olympian who's left the Toyota team that he's driven to victory at two Dakars to join the Prodrive team that he'll be with until 2027. But is he risking the chance of a record three wins in a row for the opportunity of more palms down the road?
Carlos Sainz and Nasser Al-Attiyah are rarely seen together and even more rarely in a head-to-head interview – so are they smiling or speaking through clenched their teeth? You can decide for yourself…
03
Could you race the Dakar with your brother?
26 min
Could you race the Dakar with your brother?
Kevin and Luciano Benavides are on rival teams (KTM and Husqvarna). Do team orders overrule family ties?
After rivals and team-mates, what's it like to be racing with your brother? Nicola Hume and Matt Jones catch up with Kevin Benavides and Luciano Benavides – with a cameo from Marc Márquez and Álex Márquez, who pose a couple of questions to the brothers. The Argentines are racing on matching machinery, but different liveries, as they line up for KTM and Husqvarna.
Rallying brothers: Kevin and Luciano Benavides
© Flavien Duhamel/Red Bull Content Pool
While Kevin has two Dakar wins to his name (2019 and 2021) in both South America and Saudi Arabia, Luciano, six years his junior, arrives as the reigning Rally Raid World Champion.
“This is the best race in the world because of the adventure, the adrenaline and the feeling of freedom in the desert,” says Kevin. “Every time you cross the finish line, you want to come back and start again.”
The brothers are ultra-competitive, training together in the gym, on bikes and on track – even over lunch – and their close relationship means that even arguments are settled and forgotten quickly. But it does add an extra level of concern when racing. “We're so competitive,” says Kevin. “But during the race, in the rally, I always look at him, if he's okay, if he’s doing alright. You know, our sport is quite risky.”
Kevin encountered such a scenario on Lucian’s Dakar debut in 2018 when the young rider had a bad crash. When I went back to my motorhome, I saw Luciano’s helmet there and I thought, ‘Oh.’ Later they told me Luciano had crashed and was in hospital. It was a really tough day,” he says.
Luciano agrees, saying he followed Kevin on the morning of stage two, only for his Sentinel tracking device to alert him that a rider had fallen on the road ahead. He held his breath until he realized it was not his brother and the rider was safe.
And the Dakar bivouac is no stranger to family-teams and Nicola talks to Dakar legend Alfie Cox, whose son Bradley is competing in his second Dakar in the Originals category. Bradley describes it as two weeks of bonding with his dad, while for Alfie it’s a roller coaster of emotions.
04
Could your average Joe take on 9,000km?
39 min
Could your average Joe take on 9,000km?
We explore the physical and mental stamina required for the brutal 9,000km journey of the Dakar Rally.
This fourth installment looks into the gritty reality of the Dakar Rally with reigning W2RC champion Seth Quintero, Sonora Rally champion Daniel Sanders and trail-blazing rally star Dania Akeel. The trio sheds light on the strength of body and mind required to undertake the treacherous 9,00km journey.
Discussing the grueling demands of the Dakar, Bike class contender Daniel Sanders underscores the peculiar nature of the race. With no roll cage or co-driver, competitors on two wheels encounter unparalleled difficulties. He emphasizes the self-reliance demanded by the rally: “It's all dependent on us through the stage, every day, and that’s pretty insane because your mistake is your mistake. You own it as well. That, and managing the risk you ought to take to be at the top, is probably the hardest thing.”
Daniel Sanders demonstrating why Dakarists need serious metal strength
© Florent Gooden/DPPI/Red Bull Content Pool
Dania Akeel, the first Saudi woman to receive a racing license, navigates the Dakar in a Taurus T3 buggy without a windscreen or any kind of air-con system in the punishing desert conditions. “I don't notice those things, because I'm looking at the track. I'm thinking about the navigation, and I'm just really zeroed in,” she says. “On the road sections, it gets uncomfortable after multiple hours however. The back gets a bit sore, a bit tense. In the stage, I'm fine – there’s a lot of bumps, you’re being tossed in different directions and there's blood circulation. And the suspensions of our car is lightweight, so we dance.”
Driving is less smooth forSeth Quintero and his new Toyota Hilux T1 car. He reveals that he can feel the weight of the two-tonne vehicle due to the stiff suspension, making it a lot less comfortable than his previous T3 cars."You feel your eyeballs drooping. Whenever you hit the bottom of a dune, you can feel everything compress and fall,” the young American explains. “The seating position that you're in isn't always the greatest either, and sometimes the neck starts to hurt, but you have got the air conditioning, the doors, the windows – you’ve got all the hot commodities."
The conversation then shifts to the mental aspect of Dakar racing, particularly the solitary experience for those on motorbikes. “It's just mental strength,” says Sanders. “You’re playing with your demons up in your head, pushing through everything and trying to enjoy the ride.”
When asked about maintaining concentration, he reveals his method to keep his brain engaged and positive: “For the road sections, there's a bit of singing going on. You’re trying to get your mood back up, because the cold mornings get to you and you’ve just got to push on through it.”
Talking about their mental state throughout the two race weeks, Akeel highlights her approach of treating each day independently and avoiding carrying the baggage of a bad day into the next. Quintero echoes this sentiment: “Every day is the first day.”
Dania Akeel and co-driver Stephane Duple take on Stage 8
© Marcelo Maragni/Red Bull Content Pool
“Bike or car or whatever it is, it's going to be draining no matter what. Anybody that says this race is super enjoyable, I think they’re lying a little,” the 21-year-old Californian explains. “You can enjoy parts of it, but I don't think you're enjoying every second of it. You love racing, you love doing it all, but 12 days, no matter what you're doing, is going to be a lot.”
Akeel shares that before the race, she extensively targeted her mental performance to avoid falling into last year’s psychological pattern. After securing a top-10 position in her first rally in 2022 and fueled by high expectations, she anticipated a top-five finish the following year – but it didn’t unfold that way. “I was tense and I didn't have fun,” she explains. “I just kept thinking about results, and I just became very caught in this mental space.” She attests that things changed for her when she shifted her focus to stage results and started enjoying the ride again: “If you remember that you’re here by choice, it eases everything. I'm not here because of results – that’s an outcome – but I love being here and I wouldn't want to be anywhere else.”
Quintero reinforces the idea: “The more fun I have and the more I smile, the way better I am and the faster I go. I remember one day – the record year, we'll call it – where my navigator Dennis [Zenz] and I talked for the entire stage about sandwiches and food, and what we were going to do when we got home. I think there was only one moment where I thought I was racing. That day we won by almost 20 minutes, and that's why the mental side of things for me is so much more important than the physical aspect.”
Seth Quintero likes to keep things light in the car and bivouac
© Marcelo Maragni/Red Bull Content Pool
05
Marathon stage: surviving 48 hours in the desert
29 min
Marathon stage: surviving 48 hours in the desert
Uncover the brutal 48-hour solo marathon stage through the story of first-time Dakar competitor Tobias Ebster.
In the dusty expanse of Saudi Arabia's Empty Quarter, the largest continuous desert on earth, the Dakar Rally encountered a new frontier – the 48-hour Chrono Stage – and Spanish Challenger category driver Cristina Gutiérrez and Austrian Bike class rookie Tobias Ebster recount their journey through this unprecedented challenge to hosts Nicola Hume and Rob Warner.
The 48-hour Chrono Stage marked a radical departure from the norm, spanning 626km for bikes and 549 kilometers for cars. It wasn't just about covering the distance though; it was a test of resilience. Besides tending to themselves and their vehicles, Dakar racers were required to bring supplies and camp in the desert. Ebster, currently grappling with a cracked rib, describes the overnight struggle: “When we arrived, at sunset, we got a sleeping bag but no mattress, so we had to sleep on the ground.”
Gutiérrez paints a harrowing picture of the relentless race over the soft-sanded dunes: ”It was dune after dune after dune. It took us seven and half hours to cover the first 400km. Some drivers experienced travel sickness, so they took some pills for it, but even then they felt sick – it’s like when you’re on a boat at sea."
Cristina Gutiérrez gets strapped in for another day of Dakar racing
© Marcelo Maragni/Red Bull Content Pool
The harsh realities of the desert emerge as the narrative is punctuated by tales of survival, including Cesare Zacchetti's night in the dark, covered in sand after his bike got stuck. Host Nicola Hume recounts the ordeal: “It ended up being dark and the helicopter couldn't find him. They searched for him extensively, having a rough idea of his location. A survival package was dropped, but he never found it, so he had to cover himself with sand to keep warm overnight.”
The duo faced not only the natural obstacles, but also inadequacies in the preparations. From the unexpected softness of the dunes affecting fuel consumption to the challenges of navigating without established tracks, every moment was a trial. “One eye looks at the road map, the other looks ahead,” says Gutiérrez.
“For me, for now, it's good,” adds Ebster. “I'm around the top 20, so I have a few traces in front of me. But for the top guys, it's difficult. You have to imagine, there is no trace and you have to set your own line in the sand – and everybody's going to follow you. So, when you're wrong, everybody's wrong.”
Amid these challenges, the camaraderie around the fire in the camps became a beacon of warmth. both competitors share the funny and memorable moments they spent with racing legends Carlos Sainz and Nasser Al-Attiyah, revealing how the former struggled with his tent while setting it up, while the latter offered tea while sitting around the fire.
Tobias Ebster faces the hard reality of racing across endless dunes
© Marcelo Maragni/Red Bull Content Pool
"We were sharing stories with each other under the light of the stars. It was warm, we enjoyed it. Not many people can experience this adventure during their lives, I'm feeling very blessed. Sitting by the fire was something special and I'm never going to forget that,” says Ebster.
Gutiérrez resonates with the Austrian’s words: “It made the race so much more interesting. It’s difficult to find these moments in your normal life, because you always have mobile coverage and a cellphone at hand. We were there in the middle of nowhere, in the dark, with no lights. We could only see how many stars were in the sky – that sky was massive.”
As the 48-hour endurance test concluded, emotions kept running the gamut – from frustration over missing mattresses to the relief of finishing the punishing stage, but the fifth episode of In The Dust shows us that physical resistance is the driving force when tackling the desert and that in the Empty Quarter the stars outnumber the challenges.
06
How not to get lost in the desert
33 min
How not to get lost in the desert
Finding your way from point A to point B in the desert becomes a huge challenge for Dakar competitors.
When you’re racing 9,000km across an entire country that’s filled with vast stretches of almost featureless desert, getting totally and utterly lost is an ever-present and potentially race-ruining risk – especially at the sharp end of the leaderboards.
So, how do Dakar Rally’s competitors keep on the right track? In the Dust hosts Rob Warner and Nicola Hume sit down with current Car class contender Lucas Moraes and his co-driver Armand Monleon, as well Dakar legends Jordi Viladoms and Mathieu Baumel to get a crash course on the essential rally raid skill of road book reading and the vitally important role co-drivers play in the success – or failure – of the four-wheeled competitors.
Lucas Moraes and Armand Monleon power across yet another dune
© Marcelo Maragni/Red Bull Content Pool
The road book is the the holy scroll of the Dakar – literally in the case of the bikers, who still use printed road book scrolls – and as the sole instruction competitors receive on how to navigate through each stage, understanding that information and communicating it instantaneously to their driver is the essential skill of a co-driver, as Monleon explains: “Each crew has their own personal lexicon, but the road book gives us all a ‘standard’ lexicon, so you need to understand what the road book is saying and translate that to the internal lexicon between the crew.”
One look at the baffling array of symbols and numbers on the road books shown on screen confirms that’s an incredibly feat. Monleon, a former Bike class competitor himself, proved he’s a master of his craft however as despite racing their first Dakar together, the pair scored their first-ever stage win on Stage 3. Moraes is in no doubt about how important his new navigator was to that success.
“To be honest, in the Dakar I think the co-driver is more important than the driver,” explains the Brazilian. “The navigation is really, really hard and the pace we are going at now, you have to be so, so precise.” Monleon expands on this: “The job of the navigator isn’t just to not get lost. Your main job is to not get lost, yes, but also to give the maximum anticipation to the driver to let them carry the maximum speed possible.” Onboard footage from inside the cars showing just how limited the field of vision Moraes and other drivers have only reinforces the role a good co-driver plays. There’s a very good reason why Monleon prefers the term navigator to co-driver.
Sam Sunderland makes final notes to his road book ahead of Stage 3
© Marcelo Maragni/Red Bull Content Pool
Later in the episode, multi-time Dakar Rally winning co-driver Mathieu Baumel and former Bike class contender Jordi Viladoms, the man in charge of getting KTM’s riders up to speed with road book reading, join the chat and right off the bat they make it very clear – getting lost is part and parcel of racing the Dakar Rally: “It’s very, very easy. Too easy sometimes.”
Baumel, the legendary co-driver who sits alongside Nasser Al-Attiyah, explains in more detail: “One day without any mistakes is impossible. To do a full stage, for example tomorrow, which is 483km with probably 500 or 600 different notes, you can’t be perfect on every one. It’s not possible.”
The key to success then is limiting the major mistakes, the ones that leave competitors desperately searching for the waypoint markers that they must trigger at various points during each stage. That’s essentially what Jordi Viladoms does for his job now, training the KTM, Husqvarna and GasGas riders to master the art of deciphering road books whilst riding flat out, essentially by going off exploring the desert on a bike and then creating a road book that his riders have to follow. “If you’re not at races, it’s really difficult to train navigation,” explains the Spanish veteran. “I try to recreate as close as possible what we can find in the Dakar, so we go out to the desert training this.”
When Baumel interjects with the news that competitors receive the road book each day just “five minutes before the start”, the importance of the ability to process information at an incredible pace is really brought into focus. “I discover the route during the stage,” he explains. “You cannot prepare anything so you have to good anticipation and try and check the next boxes to see what will happen next.”
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